San Fairy Ann Cycle Club

I'm looking for advice about what to specify in a new PC. Our webmaster Russell has a friend who is willing to build me a new PC as cheaply as possible if I let him know just what I want. I don't know a motherboard from a usb but I do know what I want a computer to do.

These are my requirements:-
- Sufficient speed,power and hard disk space to do basic video editing without ultra long rendering times.
- Cheapest suitable graphics card - I'm not into gaming.
- Ability to use the monitor as a TV.
I assume that this will then easily cope with everything else, mostly club admin work.

I've been looking at doing this for some time but didn't want to be one of the early Vista users and from what I've read about it I was probably right. I understand that anyone buying Vista now can upgrade to the new Windows 7 system in January at whatever Microsoft consider to be a a nominal charge.

I would like to keep all my familiar programmes and suspect that some older ones may not be upgraded for Windows. I believe it is possible to run 2 operating systems - if so I will keep XP Home as it's still possible to buy this.

Suggestions for the necessary components will be very welcome.

Ron

Hi Ron, just some thoughts on your new Computer:-

Back in the old days, the user experience and the Perceptible Performance of a Computer was mainly a function of the speed of the CPU (central processing unit). The faster you pedalled the faster you went. Nowadays more than ever its down to the whole package, memory cpu, software etc... And the industry is proliferated with acronyms so appologies in advanced.

Desktop or Laptop ?
CPU (Central Processing Unit) speed
number of core's in the CPU (1 core is effecitvely a single CPU, 2 core's are 2 CPU's etc....)
CPU Cache (very fast access memory built into the CPU)
memory (type, speed and capacity)
Disk Speed (not capacity)
Graphics card are like seperate computers within a computer hence CPU & memory of the card are important.
Operating system
What you want todo with the computer
Can your software work with the new hardware setup
Internet connection.

For example if all you do is browse the internet, buying a fast expensive new computer will unlikely change your user experience that much.

A reasonable Desktop setup that should cost around £500 including TV Monitor would be something similar to below:-
CPU. Intel Dual Core, 2.4Ghz speed, 1Mb cache
Memory. DDR2 and about 4Gb will cope with most video editing.
Disk Speed. Tell him the faster the better . 500 Gb capacity will probably be sufficient
Graphics card. Something like a Nvidia GeForce 9800Gt
Windows Vista is over its troubles and is a good operating system. Importantly is understands the modern hardware and works well. XP support will be dropped by Microsoft soon due to the new operatings system "Windows 7" about to hit the shelves which means that bug fixes and security holes will not be fixed in XP. My advice would be stay away from "Windows 7" until Microsoft release the first update which fixes all the problems (12 months or so away).
I would reccomend investing in the latest version of your video editing software that is compatible with Vista as this will work better than your old XP version. Alternatively the free software with Vista for doing this is pretty good albeit basic.
On board sound should be sufficient.

I would avoid running 2 operating systems. Technically a dual boot (as it is known) is easy to setup but makes for a more complicated configuration providing more opportunity for it to go wrong. Keep it simple. Imagine all the updates and antivirus patches you will need to apply twice. Legally with a dual boot you will be exposed to more licences consequently the cost of the setup could prove more expensive.

If the video's are important to you make sure you have a backup. External USB backup disks are ideal for this and relatively cheap compared to the cost of trying to recover all those pictures and videos.

I'm sure you'll have a ton of other questions, just let me know.

Thinks, 400 SFA members quickly printing off the free advice!

re. windows 7 - contrary to what Phill says it's essentially just a big service pack for Vista, it's not an entirely new OS thus doesn't have the usual problems*. If you get Windows 7 professional, you can actually run win XP within it**. FWIW, few people actually like Vista.

Anyhow, if you want a motherboard, CPU and some RAM, I'm looking to sell the following:

Athlon 64 3000+ (with original fan attached)
1GB of RAM (2x 512 Mb DDR PC3200 sticks)
Motherboard (Foxconn NF4UK8AC)

If you can collect it, it's yours for £25. For £100 you could build the entire thing into a functional PC, less if you have got stuff you can steal from an existing machine.

*Vista was Windows 6. Someone found a bit of Windows 7 where it was actually found to be labelled as Windows 6.1!

**Phill tells me that there are some Intel CPUs that won't be able to run the XP mode within Windows strangely.

Thinks, 400 SFA members quickly screwing up their bits of paper and missing the waste paper basket by about 6ft (Well, we're cyclsts after all!)

Rob you need to get out more...

What I can't get my head around is how you strap the damn thing to your handlebars!

I know of someone who carried a 5.1 speaker system, amp and stands on their bike. A motherboard's no problem!

You're not wrong Iann!

Back to the serious stuff - many thanks Phill and Rob. I'll get Windows 7 Pro and avoid the need to have 2 operating systems.

I've got a 600GB external hard drive with all the club stuff backed onto it and started to use it for video editing before giving up in frustration at the painfully slow speeds. I didn't realise that hard disks have different speeds - what should I be looking at as a minimum? Presumably this is why some are more expensive than others?

I'm a bit (?) confused over the various ways that the Memory specifications are listed in adverts. How does "2 x 2Gb 240Pin DDR2 800Mhz" equate to Phill's suggested DDR 2 and 4MB? What is the 800Mhz?

Rob, I'll get Russell's friend to tell me if he can make use of your bits.

To be continued............

Re Rob, I'll get Russell's friend to tell me if he can make use of your bits.

To be continued............[/quote]
Ron


I am waiting with bated breath to see what suggestions John Bosley has re making use of Rob's bits

Pasty

PS I could put a bit in the next mag re anybody who wants Rob's bits? Or John's come to that.

@ pat!

re. memory: 800mHz is the speed it runs at. A higher number here is better. It was 4Gb, not 4Mb; we've not measured total memory in Mb for years!

My system might actually end up being a little slow for your liking Ron, but it was doing me fine up until I started CFD modelling on it! It all depends what your current system is and how much you want to spend. My offer wouldn't compete with Phill's suggestion on performance, but it'll be significantly cheaper.

Ron

With regard to memory there are various tricks that the manufacturers use to increase the amount of data you can transfer to and from the memory. The throughput of data to the memory is a function of the speed and width of the data bus. Think of it as motorway where there are 3 lanes all moving at 70mph (unless its the M25 of course). To get more vehicles through the motorway you could increase the speed or increase the number of lanes or both. DDR2 is the latest trick so you want to go with this technology and the faster the speed the better, 800Mhz is very good.

Note that most motherboards only have 4 slots for Memory. So to get 4Gbytes of memory you could have a single 4Gbyte chip, 2 x 2Gbyte chips or 4 x 1Gbyte chips. 2 x 2Gbyte is a good combination leaving room for possible more memory at a later stage.

Now for disk drives. Yes they have different speeds (read speed / write speed / seek speed). Whats more depending on the use of the computer the different speed measurements are more or less important. The rotational speed of the disk and the amount of cache memory on the disk drive will be the easiest way of judging performance and for video editing you need a good performance drive. Typical disk drives rotates at 5400rpm but you may want to look at the next step up which is a 7200 rpm drive. The more cache memory the better and a typical cache is 32Mb (yes thats MB).

And this disk drive should be internal to the computer because the bus (think motorway) internal to the computer is faster and wider than an external bus (think USB).